You make more than $25 an hour | Kristin Luck
NOTE You make more than $25 an hour | Kristin Luck
Kristin Luck: And she was like, "Kristen, do you make more than $25 an hour?
Kristin Luck: Why are you cleaning the bathroom?"
Kristin Luck: You know, we didn't slow down on the sales and marketing.
Kristin Luck: And so then the following year that you, as you were running it, that part of the business, we grew by 156%.
Kristin Luck: Business of research, and then there's the business of running a research business.
Kristin Luck: The best time to sell is when you're on that upward swing, when the company is profitable, when you're actively bringing in new clients, like that is the right time.
Jamin Brazil: Hi, I'm Jamin, and welcome to my show.
Jamin Brazil: Back in 2000, I co-founded Decipher.
Jamin Brazil: That same year, today's guest co-founded OTS.
Jamin Brazil: Kristen Luck later came to Decipher as partner, president, and CMO, and was with us through the sell to ProVision, which was a PE-backed strategic transaction.
Jamin Brazil: Kristen founded Women in Research, where she serves as board chair, and was the president of SMR from 2021 to 2023.
Jamin Brazil: Across more than 20 years in consumer insights, she's been a founder, a board director,
Jamin Brazil: and now an investment banker.
Jamin Brazil: Currently, she is managing director at Oberon Securities, where she sits on the other side of the table and helps founders in data and insights sell their companies.
Jamin Brazil: This show is about three things: scaling, systems, and career.
Jamin Brazil: Kristen has lived all three.
Jamin Brazil: One disclosure before we start, Kristen and I co-led a cohort of CEOs for three years, so this isn't a cold interview, and you'll hear that.
Jamin Brazil: Kristen, welcome to the show.
Kristin Luck: Yeah, thanks for having me.
Jamin Brazil: So you've held three fundamentally different seats.
Jamin Brazil: Obviously, founder, where it's your own company more than a few times, board director, where you advise- Yeah ... and can't touch the controls, and now, of course- ... a banker, where you're across the table from the founder.
Jamin Brazil: What do you have to unlearn while moving between them?
Kristin Luck: Oh, God, a lot.
Kristin Luck: A lot, and they're not easy things to unlearn.
Kristin Luck: I mean, I think that certainly once I started running companies, it was a big wake-up call for me because as
Kristin Luck: you know, w- you know, there's the business of research, and then there's the business of running a research business.
Kristin Luck: Hmm.
Kristin Luck: Those are two fundamentally different, different skill sets.
Kristin Luck: And so for me, who I've, uh, had always functioned as an operator, so someone actually working in the business, you know, managing the technology development of the operational build-out, the scaling,
Kristin Luck: all of those things, o- once you pivot into an executive role where you're actually running the company day to day, you are not able to do those things anymore.
Kristin Luck: And so if you're a real good doer like I am, like I love, I love like checking things off my list- Mm-hmm ... and, you know, feeling like I'm really working in the business, it was tough for me to realize that I couldn't, I couldn't function like that anymore.
Kristin Luck: The business wasn't gonna scale.
Kristin Luck: Um, so I would say, you know, when I transitioned from, you know, working for big companies, like I worked for Material Plus and Nielsen before I started my own company, but I was always in more of a doer role,
Kristin Luck: and then I really had to fundamentally change my behaviors once I became a founder because you can't be doing all the time.
Kristin Luck: Right.
Kristin Luck: You can't be working in that business day to day.
Kristin Luck: Then when I transitioned into consulting and board roles, I think to your point, when you're sitting on a board, yes, you're offering advice and input and help, um, periodically, but you don't really...
Kristin Luck: You're not running the company.
Kristin Luck: So- You can give the advice, but you can't force someone to take it necessarily.
Kristin Luck: Mm-hmm.
Kristin Luck: Uh, and that, you know, that can be frustrating or that, you know, you're responsible for helping the company look at what the priorities should be in the coming year, and you're not necessarily always in line with those priorities, or you see an opportunity, but the business can't take advantage of it.
Kristin Luck: And so I think it's...
Kristin Luck: It was a good lesson for me that, yes, I might know a lot about the business and I'm giving, you know, like, what I think is the best advice, but
Kristin Luck: it's not necessarily advice that someone is gonna take.
Kristin Luck: Mm.
Kristin Luck: And you have to be okay with that and be okay with like, okay, you know, like, that's not my battle to win.
Kristin Luck: I'm here to advise, and I've advised, and that's my role.
Jamin Brazil: Mm-hmm.
Kristin Luck: I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna be the one implementing.
Jamin Brazil: Right.
Kristin Luck: So yeah.
Kristin Luck: And then I would say once I transitioned into a banking...
Kristin Luck: Well, I mean, I s- I still sit on boards, so that hasn't gone away.
Kristin Luck: Right.
Kristin Luck: But, you know, once, once I transitioned to a banking role, then it's even more so like you're looking at these businesses, you're trying to determine a valuation or to give the founders advice on when the right time to sell is.
Kristin Luck: And like for me, I just see so many opportunities, and I know you and I have talked about this before, like when we were running Decipher.
Kristin Luck: We felt like everybody was doing it better than us.
Kristin Luck: Mm.
Kristin Luck: Like oh, all these other businesses are p- are probably outperforming us.
Kristin Luck: There's probably something that we're doing wrong.
Kristin Luck: Mm.
Kristin Luck: Like, we don't know what we don't know.
Kristin Luck: And now having been on the other side of the table, we really, I mean, we really had our shit together.
Jamin Brazil: We really did.
Kristin Luck: We really knew what we were doing, yeah.
Kristin Luck: And you know, I think that could we have gone on to scale the company significantly, um, to a significantly larger revenue number than what we did?
Kristin Luck: Mm-hmm.
Kristin Luck: For sure we could have, but hindsight's 20/20.
Kristin Luck: You don't, you don't know what you don't know- Mm-hmm ... going into a, a transaction, and certainly, you know, none of the three of us really had any banking experience yet.
Kristin Luck: Like, I had been through a transaction before, so I knew what was coming, but I think that there were probably a lot of things that we could have done before the process to really optimize it for sale,
Kristin Luck: which is I think some of the most rewarding work that I'm doing now is working with founders and helping them understand, "Hey, if you pulled these two or three levers, your, your multiple would go up significantly."
Kristin Luck: Um-
Jamin Brazil: Yeah ...
Kristin Luck: you know, and seeing founders, like really meaningfully optimi- you know,
Kristin Luck: monetize their business to me is like the most rewarding job that I can have.
Jamin Brazil: Yeah, I, gosh, I tell you what, I really wish we could unwind the clock a little bit and-
Kristin Luck: Right.
Jamin Brazil: Right?
Jamin Brazil: Yeah.
Jamin Brazil: Uh, it would've made all the difference in the world.
Jamin Brazil: Yeah.
Jamin Brazil: But you know, to your point, there's no reason to arm cha- armchair quarterback your, uh, uh, your history.
Jamin Brazil: You just don't know what you don't, don't know.
Jamin Brazil: I, I w- Right ...
Jamin Brazil: I, I would say, though, that getting an advisor, if you're thinking about- Mm-hmm ... a transaction, is absolutely vital, and we didn't have the luxury of that at the time.
Jamin Brazil: We had hired a banker, but that was different, uh, 'cause they're motivated- Yeah ... in just a quick transaction.
Jamin Brazil: But yeah, it w- that would've been a, that would've been a h- that would've had a monumental difference on, on the outcome of the business.
Jamin Brazil: All right.
Jamin Brazil: So- Of the three roles, which one from your view- Mm-hmm
Jamin Brazil: is the hardest to be new in?
Kristin Luck: Oh, being a founder for sure- ... is the hardest.
Kristin Luck: For sure.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: I mean, I started my first company when I think I
Kristin Luck: was 30.
Kristin Luck: I mean, I had no clue what I was doing.
Kristin Luck: I, no ...
Kristin Luck: And it's really funny because I, I've been asked a few times by people, like, "Where did..." You know, like, "How did you summon up the courage to start a company?"
Kristin Luck: And I was like, "I was 30 years old." It never, literally never occurred to me that it wouldn't work.
Kristin Luck: Right.
Jamin Brazil: Yeah.
Jamin Brazil: Totally.
Kristin Luck: Never.
Kristin Luck: And also I think when you're that young too, it's like, yeah, if you have a failure, it's not the end of the world.
Kristin Luck: You're gonna pick yourself up and get another job.
Kristin Luck: But literally it never occurred to me that it would fail, and I felt the same way going into Decipher, and I think that's kind of been my guiding light for anything I do, which is that I have to have, I have to be blindly confident- Mm
Kristin Luck: that it's gonna work.
Jamin Brazil: Confidence, it carries you through those rough patches, and the rough patches, they're very, they're terrible.
Kristin Luck: Oh, for
Jamin Brazil: sure.
Jamin Brazil: Right?
Jamin Brazil: But, but- Yeah ... but you have to maintain- Oh, yeah ... that, that stable, that stable mentality that it's gonna work out.
Jamin Brazil: I remember the 2000 and...
Jamin Brazil: Remember the 2009 debacle?
Jamin Brazil: Uh, we had lost- Yeah ... a material amount of
Jamin Brazil: our business.
Jamin Brazil: We had to close our LA office.
Jamin Brazil: I mean, it was just a shit show, like through and through.
Jamin Brazil: But, you know, we didn't slow down on the sales and marketing, and so then the following year- Yeah ... you, that you, as you were running it, that part of the business, we grew by 156%.
Jamin Brazil: And, and the reason- Yeah ... that we made the right investments back in 2009, right, the year before, did things like immediately cut salaries, obviously some closures, et cetera, hard choices that we made fast, but that gave us the war chest so that you were able to operationalize it in the marketplace.
Jamin Brazil: And when everybody else was still retrenching, you know, we were front and center.
Kristin Luck: And I think that's the, that's, you know, one of the fundamental pieces of advice that I give folks that they mostly ignore, uh- Yeah ... which is when other people go quiet and start cutting back on sales because as you know, like, um, Amir, I think when times get tough, people just immediately start looking for places to cut.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: And generally the place that they do not understand the most is gonna be sales and-
Kristin Luck: That's right ... marketing activity.
Jamin Brazil: That's right.
Kristin Luck: They just, they, people just don't, they don't understand it, and so for them it's like the easiest thing to cut, you know?
Jamin Brazil: And, and that- Um- ... and that gets down to the psychology part of it, right?
Jamin Brazil: Where it's like, okay, I'm not seeing immediate sales from this investment that I'm making, so it's easy to pull back on that lever, and that's where the belief through line- For sure ... you had is so important.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: It's huge.
Jamin Brazil: All right.
Jamin Brazil: Let's, let's talk a little bit about the core of the show here.
Jamin Brazil: So this is the confession time.
Jamin Brazil: I'm in the box.
Jamin Brazil: You're in the box.
Kristin Luck: Mm-hmm.
Kristin Luck: Okay.
Jamin Brazil: W- what's a mistake that you made when you were scaling one of your companies?
Kristin Luck: Just one?
Jamin Brazil: Okay.
Jamin Brazil: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: What's one of the thousand mistakes- Yeah ...
Kristin Luck: I've made?
Kristin Luck: Certainly, like getting too in the weeds when things weren't going well.
Jamin Brazil: Mm.
Kristin Luck: Uh, you know, like trying to...
Kristin Luck: Like I said, I come from a long line of doers and perfectionists, and
Kristin Luck: I think one of the biggest lessons I had to learn, and you and I have talked about this before, which is like don't let perfect get in the way of good enough.
Kristin Luck: Mm-hmm.
Kristin Luck: Because I have a tendency to...
Kristin Luck: I have micromanager tendencies in me.
Kristin Luck: Uh, and so when things aren't going well, I tend to start micromanaging, which is really the last thing I should be doing.
Kristin Luck: I should be focusing on the things that I need to be focusing on to grow the business and not so much worried about what is going on that is totally fine, but maybe just not the way that I would do it.
Kristin Luck: Like, just because someone's doing something the way that in a different way than I would, doesn't mean it's a bad way to do it.
Kristin Luck: It's just different Really at the end of the day.
Jamin Brazil: So do you have a specific moment that you can recall?
Jamin Brazil: I know, as you said, there's thousands of moments, and they all kind of bleed together, um, of, of that- Yeah
Jamin Brazil: that, uh, you can pull us into.
Kristin Luck: I do remember a time at OTX where, you know, it was
Kristin Luck: relatively new still in the company, and I was doing all of the roles.
Kristin Luck: And so we were slowly hiring folks and taking some of that off our, off my hands.
Kristin Luck: And we hired a, a woman to oversee, like, the analytics and reporting, so, like, putting the actual reports together.
Kristin Luck: And I remember she sent me a report for a client, and I didn't like the margin spacing- Hmm ... in the PowerPoint, and I spent, I am not kidding you, four hours-
Jamin Brazil: Hmm ...
Kristin Luck: fixing margin spacing.
Kristin Luck: For what?
Jamin Brazil: Right.
Kristin Luck: The client's never gonna...
Kristin Luck: First of all, it wasn't bad.
Kristin Luck: I just didn't like the look of it.
Kristin Luck: Mm-hmm.
Kristin Luck: Who cares?
Kristin Luck: Do you think that margin spacing is going to add an extra point to my multiple when I sell?
Kristin Luck: No.
Kristin Luck: No.
Kristin Luck: Do, do I think the client's gonna leave over it?
Kristin Luck: No, I don't.
Kristin Luck: Uh, another good example is, uh, when I started Forefront Consulting, which was the business obviously that we merged with
Kristin Luck: Decipher.
Kristin Luck: I was really trying to pinch pennies 'cause I was completely self-funded.
Kristin Luck: I was using all my own money.
Kristin Luck: And so I was working, like, 80-hour plus weeks.
Kristin Luck: Hmm.
Kristin Luck: And then I was going in on the weekends and cleaning the bathrooms myself- Right ... at the office.
Kristin Luck: And I remember sitting, I remember sitting in my hairdresser's chair in LA on, like, a weekend, and I was just crying 'cause I was so exhausted.
Kristin Luck: I was so tired.
Kristin Luck: And she was like, "Kristen, do you make more than $25 an hour?"
Kristin Luck: "Why are you cleaning the bathroom?"
Jamin Brazil: Right .
Kristin Luck: But you don't see it when you're doing it.
Jamin Brazil: Mm-hmm.
Kristin Luck: It seems like, okay, I'm s- you know, I'm saving $50 this week.
Kristin Luck: Who cares about $50 in the grand scheme of things?
Jamin Brazil: Exactly.
Jamin Brazil: Exactly.
Kristin Luck: When your own sanity is suffering.
Jamin Brazil: That's right.
Jamin Brazil: You'd be better off with two, two to three hours more of sleep.
Kristin Luck: Right?
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: Oh, sleep, yeah.
Jamin Brazil: When did you, when did you realize that in your career?
Kristin Luck: That I was a control freak?
Jamin Brazil: Uh, yeah, like, like, like- ... yeah, to your point, there's a degree of self-awareness and, and then also- Yeah ... like, you kinda start self-correcting as you recognize the behavior.
Kristin Luck: Yes.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: I'm really good at it now.
Kristin Luck: Like, I'm very good at delegating and not, not changing or going back on, on anything.
Kristin Luck: Even if it's not perfect- Mm-hmm ...
Kristin Luck: I, I, I don't do it.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: Um, but I think, I think the wake-up call for me was at OTX, and I just realized, which was a really good learning and awareness to have about myself- Mm-hmm ... when I went into Decipher that.
Jamin Brazil: Yeah, 'cause I didn't see that behavior at all.
Kristin Luck: No.
Kristin Luck: No, you didn't, 'cause I couldn't do it, and I didn't wanna work 80-hour weeks anymore, even though- You did ...
Kristin Luck: I did a lot of the time, but...
Kristin Luck: Yeah, I did, but it felt different.
Kristin Luck: Right.
Kristin Luck: Because I felt like I was doing work that I really should be doing, not, you know, not, uh, not spinning my wheels a lot and doing things that weren't gonna have any impact on the business.
Jamin Brazil: All right.
Jamin Brazil: So for founders that are
Jamin Brazil: listening, and I really do w- hope that that winds up being a material part of this, uh, audience, and they think that they're gonna sell someday, 'cause all of us have that in the background, right?
Jamin Brazil: That's the big piggy bank in the sky.
Kristin Luck: Right.
Jamin Brazil: Um- Yeah ... what's one thing that they can do differently this coming Monday morning?
Jamin Brazil: Now, this can be either a tactic or a test or a tool, so that their end result, their company, uh, is worth more.
Kristin Luck: I mean, it depends on the type of company, because if you're a software company, there's al- al- always different levers you're gonna pull than if you're a services company.
Kristin Luck: But I would say I think that the thing that most founders don't do that they should is really map out what an exit runway looks like for them.
Kristin Luck: Too often I see people go to sell when they're just out of steam for the business.
Kristin Luck: Mm.
Kristin Luck: Like, they just are done, and they want out, and that's a very difficult place to be because A, 99% chance you're not gonna be done
Kristin Luck: or out for five years.
Kristin Luck: Because you've gotta go through the sale process, and then there's an earn-out period generally, and you're gonna stay on with the business during that time period.
Kristin Luck: So you're looking at least three to four years once you start a transaction.
Kristin Luck: Um, so I think that's one thing is, like, really understanding where you're headed and what timeframe.
Kristin Luck: And the...
Kristin Luck: You could be 10 years from now.
Kristin Luck: It doesn't matter.
Kristin Luck: But the things that you will do to optimize a company, like focusing on profitability versus growth or focusing on what's your revenue per head count, which is something maybe you're not paying that much attention to when you're actually physically scaling the company.
Kristin Luck: So I think there's an awareness of, like, where you are as a company.
Kristin Luck: W- where are you in that company life cycle?
Kristin Luck: Are you in growth mode?
Kristin Luck: Are you hunkering down and trying to be profitable?
Kristin Luck: Are you gonna sell within the next three to five years?
Kristin Luck: Like, those are all sort of like- Places or triggers for changing behaviors that are going
Kristin Luck: on within the company.
Jamin Brazil: So do you think that's...
Jamin Brazil: Is that time bound, or is it, like, the monetary exit goal bound?
Kristin Luck: Either one.
Kristin Luck: I mean, I have folks that come to me and just are tired, and they're like, "I wanna retire at 60." Right.
Kristin Luck: "So what do I have to do in order to be done with this by 60?" So some of it's time based, and then others, folks come in and they're looking for a specific mul- you know, they're looking for a specific multiple or a number where they could exit, and I can give them a rough idea of valuation, and they can make their own determination then.
Kristin Luck: I will say most founders really overvalue their businesses.
Kristin Luck: Compared to, like, what an investor or a strategic is gonna pay.
Kristin Luck: Mm-hmm.
Kristin Luck: That's not always the case.
Kristin Luck: Right.
Kristin Luck: But I would say, you know, a solid 60% of the time- Yeah ... that's the case.
Kristin Luck: And so it's good to understand what the value of your company is today if you do wanna sell in the future, because then you understand, hey, if I wanna walk away with
Kristin Luck: $10 million or $20 million, here's what the business has to scale to, and this is what buyers and investors are looking for.
Jamin Brazil: That's, that's, that's so well said.
Jamin Brazil: And, and for me, the interesting part, regardless of which direction you go, time bound or, or monetary bound, that immediately starts shaping the behaviors of the things that you pay attention to- Yeah ... as opposed to, like most operators just kinda, like, go along to get along, I've, I've observed.
Kristin Luck: It's tough.
Kristin Luck: And the, you know, the thing that I've... is the toughest for me is if I've been having conversations with a founder for years.
Kristin Luck: Like, there was a conversation I had with a, you know, a guy that had, you know, a couple of years ago had a $30 million business, and then, you know, he didn't wanna sell at the time.
Kristin Luck: Mm-hmm.
Kristin Luck: He wasn't ready to sell.
Kristin Luck: The company was profitable, it was growing, all these things, you know, and then, you know, he came back this last year and the business is half the size- Wow ... that it was.
Kristin Luck: He had some pretty significant competitors come in.
Kristin Luck: Uh, he had some clients that churned and/or postponed a lot of work.
Kristin Luck: And now he's at a state where he doesn't wanna work indefinitely, but he also doesn't wanna sell when the company's half the size it was three years ago.
Kristin Luck: Also, that doesn't tell a great story for investors- Right ... and purchasers either.
Kristin Luck: Y-
Jamin Brazil: Yeah ...
Kristin Luck: people wanna see that it's a growth company that's growing year over year.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: And so the best time to sell is when you're on that upward swing, when the company is profitable, when you're actively bringing in new clients, like that is the right time.
Kristin Luck: But I see so many people that wait.
Kristin Luck: Mm.
Kristin Luck: And that's not to say that waiting is always wrong, but I do see a lot of pe- folks that are in very competitive sectors, or they're in a sector that's being really heavily hit by technology, which means that their product or service might be aging some- Mm
Kristin Luck: that just, you know- Yeah ... don't, don't catch it.
Jamin Brazil: Yeah, they miss the wave.
Jamin Brazil: Early enough.
Jamin Brazil: They miss the wave.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Jamin Brazil: All right, my last question.
Jamin Brazil: What is one question the people that are listening, the audience, should ask their own team this week?
Kristin Luck: We don't spend enough time coaching people on how they can add value to the business.
Kristin Luck: Mm.
Kristin Luck: And I think a lot of times people feel like if they're in operational roles, that they don't have any impact on either the, you know, the revenue or the profitability of a business.
Kristin Luck: Asking your teams periodically, like, "What are you specifically doing to contribute to the company's success?" And/or, "How are you helping us grow?"
Kristin Luck: I think it's good for people to realize the impact that every single role in a company has on the growth and wellness of a, of a company's financial profile.
Kristin Luck: Mm.
Kristin Luck: And I think part of it, too, and one of the things I was really proud that we did at Decipher was that we were very transparent with the financials of the company.
Jamin Brazil: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: And I think a lot of times people don't wanna share their financials because they think, "Oh, everyone's gonna think I'm like Scrooge McDuck-" "...
Kristin Luck: rolling in piles of money at night," which as you know is generally not the case.
Kristin Luck: Right.
Kristin Luck: When you don't share that information, and people don't understand what, what impact their role has on the company, then they're less invested in the company succeeding, and they'll make up stories about why the company is succeeding.
Kristin Luck: Mm.
Kristin Luck: And those stories are never positive ones.
Kristin Luck: Right.
Kristin Luck: So I think transparency, yeah, I think transparency is key, and also, like really coaching people on, hey, here's...
Kristin Luck: You know, because most of the time when you ask somebody, "How are you providing value to the business?" They won't be able to answer it.
Kristin Luck: A lot of times, particularly in more junior roles, they don't understand it.
Kristin Luck: And so I think, you know, I think that's a big piece of it.
Kristin Luck: I think, you know, just making sure that everyone in the company understands business finance and the financials of running a business.
Kristin Luck: Because otherwise people say like, "Oh, well that's not my problem."
Jamin Brazil: Right.
Jamin Brazil: "
Kristin Luck: I don't..." You know?
Kristin Luck: Well, it is your problem if the company's not performing and you get laid off, then it becomes your problem very quickly.
Jamin Brazil: You know, this is an interesting end to connecting all the way back to the beginning, thinking about the closure of our LA office, which impacted, I wanna say, around 12 souls.
Jamin Brazil: Um-
Kristin Luck: Yeah ...
Jamin Brazil: and you know, we as management, uh, took a, I might be misremembering, but I think it was around a 50% cut of our, of our compensation- Yeah
Jamin Brazil: out the get, right?
Jamin Brazil: As soon as that happened.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Jamin Brazil: Um- Yeah ... and we were, because we were transparent with the finances of the business, we didn't get any pushback.
Jamin Brazil: In fact, the opposite, we got a lot of buy-in- Mm-hmm ... fr- and, and support from staff.
Kristin Luck: There were some folks, you know, like yes, we, we took a significant cut, but we also asked some people to take bigger cuts.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: And they were okay doing it because they could see that we were all in on it.
Kristin Luck: That's
Jamin Brazil: right.
Jamin Brazil: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: And I think that's part of leading by example- Mm-hmm ... too, which is, yeah, when the going gets tough, like we all have to share in that pain.
Kristin Luck: And particularly for you and Jayme and I, as
Kristin Luck: the, you know, folks running the company, it's important that people see that we are taking a hit as well.
Kristin Luck: Yeah.
Kristin Luck: And that, you know, to my earlier point, we're not at home at night rolling around in piles of money.
Jamin Brazil: That's great.
Jamin Brazil: It's a good, it's a funny visual, one I've never realized, but maybe someday.
Kristin Luck: It sure is.
Kristin Luck: Scrooge McDuck, that's one of my favorite...
Kristin Luck: Yeah, I'm always like, "Do you think I'm like Scrooge McDuck rolling around in piles of money at night?"
Kristin Luck: I mean-
Jamin Brazil: That'd be great ...
Kristin Luck: I am now sometimes, but- Not at that point I wasn't.
Jamin Brazil: Our guest today has been Kristen Luck, managing director at Oberon Securities and founder of Women in Research.
Jamin Brazil: Kristen, thank you for joining us today.
Kristin Luck: Yeah, thanks for having me.
Jamin Brazil: If you've enjoyed this episode, take a second, give it a, give the show a five star rating on Apple Podcast or Spotify or wherever you listen to podcasts.
Jamin Brazil: It genuinely helps other people like you find the show.
Jamin Brazil: That's it for me.
Jamin Brazil: Thanks for tuning in, and have a great rest of your day.
